[Solitaire]

When I saw the fireman pic for this month's *whisper whisper* I decided to give my contribution a more serious sub topic.

...but before I start working on it I want to know 'bout your opinions because I don't know if someone's get it all fault as it's a sensitive topic.
The thing is that these boysoldiers came into my mind while reasoning about what to draw...
I remembered the photo of A.H. shaking the hands of the last groups of boysoldiers during the last fights in Berlin 1945, sending these misleaded children to the fights although A.H. just committed suicide some time later - a very sad and tragical showdown in my eyes...

here's my raw

[EviLToYLeT]

Hrmm..... I really don't know what message your trying to convey, but right now it looks kind of a parent telling his child that he's doing good and the childs happy with admiration etc. Btw, .. might want to include something in the background to show that it is in berlin or mayb eeven an excerpt of the war ------ explosions.

[Solitaire]

The message is that these kids were that conditioned to believe in their "F�hrer", that they even followed his orders in strong belief of the final victory although the allies were only some kilometres away from the capital.
Most of'em (those been to the HJ) never questioned the will of the NS authorities in this case the "F�hrer" himself.

...well and that's my criticism - I know that's hardly recognizable in that pic - I thought the glaring eyes could transfer the message :/

well, as for now I only sketched some bombed houses, but when I go to detail I'll take some Berlin specific builings, fog and it I think dawn might deliver a certain mood.

[EviLToYLeT]

The eyes actually do transfer the message pretty well. It may be to your interest to expand the picture to include the persons face so you can recognize who it is. and i'm not sure if this would work, but you can paint in expression of anxiety(anxious to meet the man) on the soilders in the background instead of having them be shilloutes. That would greatly improve the message. Right now, looks like an award cermeony of some sort. Good luck with your picture though . Looks promising.

[edit] btw, the shoulders look a little broad. Might want to adjust that if you want more kidlike and smaller. Then again, you could always have the uniform be a little too big for the guy. [/edit]

[This message has been edited by EviLToYLeT (edited December 05, 2000).]

[egerie]

Solitaire, have you seen the movie "Le Roi des Aulnes" ? Also tittled The Ogre in english and Der Unhold in er.. german ?

moving.
-ege

[Solitaire]

you're right - it looks damn like an award ceremony...hmmm...but I think adding the rest of Adolph won't change that feel :/...
grmpf...
maybe I've to add a headline or another sort of typo...

well you got a point with the shoulders and silhouettes...I'll try to change that.


egerie - haven't seen it or can't remember it, but I'll keep my eyes open
what's the plot?
The only movie that just came to my mind of dealing with this problem is "Die Br�cke" (the bridge).

[egerie]

Thank goodness for the internet movie database
Unhold, Der (1996)

Didn't wanted to spam the forum with 3 pages worth of stuff. cheers !
-ege

[Jaymo]

The idea ain't bad, still it's very hard not to make this look like nazi-propaganda. So I would NOT make this photorealistic, better do something surreal about color, shapes or else.
Just my 2 pfennig.

[Dives]

Nice but i think some wounded people would be in order to add some drama to the picture.

[Solitaire]

thanks eegerie !

well it looks as if it's a bad idea proceeding with this idea (sorry Jaimo I am not a good surealist or expressionis )....

[Fianchetto!]

Solitaire- Well, I like the idea. I have seen these proprganda films from 1944-45 and what I really remember of these boys is their fear and determination all rolled up. I WOULD continue with this and make it as realistic as you like. After all it's ART! If I may, I would suggest pursing his lips and and having the jaw protrude like you do when you are nervous. (You know, when your nervous your face gets real tight, your teeth are clenched, all of your jaw muscles are flexed and you have that nervous exhale?) Well, I would also say show some fear in his eyes. Lets be honest, at about that time bombings and food shortages and word of death was becoming widely spread. I realize that these children were kept uninformed (for their own good) in the state but they would have heard or felt something. I assume that the hand and arm is that of AH?

Anyway, it's just my opinion. OBW your city rocks!

-Phil

[Solitaire]

Well, the problem is; if people misunderstand this one as propaganda pic (which isn't intended - it's meant to be the opposite) I have to skip it.
I hoped focusing on the boy would implicitly tell the whole backstory of the image which obviously didn't worked; so I've to be consequent...

[Jaymo]

I didn't mean you should stop the project. I just wanted to help it to make the impression you were going for. Right now it's just looking too "nice", IMHO. Since you can explain your work here, don't be afraid to do stuff like this. As long as you don't wear it as a t-shirt...

[Solitaire]

A pic has to be self explanatory, so the only solution to deliver the right message is to use some kinda typo support as there won't be a difference in the mood of the pic if I'd show more of the scene (maybe that'd cause the opposite)...

hmm....delicate situation