[Budoka]

Hi. I was just wandering what you lot thought of the use of marijuana in the form of dope, grass etc. (not talking about heroin and stuff).
Here in the UK the law says no to drugs, but loads of people smoke grass. What does the law say in your country and what do think of smoking normal cigarettes - taking into account that the only ill effect you get from grass is a paranoia after years of heavy use and with cigarettes you get stuff like cancer and asthma etc.

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It's better to burn out than fade away�

[Ian]

Well, in Singapore they will kill with more than 15 oz. on you and in the states they are fighting a losing war against drugs (I have lived in both countries...) And I don't think it is a good idea to smoke those cancer sticks that the tobacco companies are churning out, but I do think it is nice to smoke a joint now and then to relax with friends. That's my view on the subj...

-FUNNY THING! I was coming out of sleep this morning actually thinking of putting up a post saying pretty much what you asked.

quote

Quote:

I was just wandering what you lot thought of the use of marijuana

funny 'eh?

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Sit on my face, and tell me that you LOVE me!

[Jess]

Ian, do you mean that in Singapore they will kill you if you have more than 15oz?

[Budoka]

[edited cause it didn't make much sense- a problem of mine]

[This message has been edited by Budoka (edited March 04, 2001).]

[Budoka]

Yeah Ian, thats pretty much my view on it. Oh and I second Jess's question - kill? Like jail or what?

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It's better to burn out than fade away�

[Impaler]

Heh. Budoka. Jess. I guess you guys have never been to Singapore. They actually KILL you for having drugs there. They end your life. You're arrested for chewing gum in public. Singapore views it as the harsher the punishment, the less crimes committed. They're right, too. Singapore has one of the lowest crime rates in the world...

As for the weed, there's a completely fallacious myth that you won't die, etc. from smoking it.

Wrong.

What gives you lung cancer? Not nicotine. Not the flavor. It's the hot stinky smoky air that essentially kills all the cells inside your lungs, making it easier for malevolent cancer cells to stay there.

What does smoking a joint do? Send hot stinky smoke straight into your lungs. And what's worse? You hold it there longer than you would a cigarette. On purpose. The only reason that people think that cigarettes are the only smokesticks that give you cancer is because the majority of people that smoke weed also smoke cigarettes, so it negates all marjiuana-specific research.

Trust me on this one. My grandfather never smoked a cigarette in his life. Yet he died of lung cancer. Why? He got high everyday.

More ill effects of marijuana you say? Sure. You get fat from all the snacks you eat when you have the munchies. You get stupid, simply because getting high is basically killing brain cells, turning off certain synapses, etc. You get extremely lazy, especially with heavy use, because you're fat and stupid, AND because it slows responses, so you're less willing to actually do anything but sit there and "chill wit da homies, blazing the green, yo.". You get arrested, mostly because weed is illegal. when you get caught, you lose friends and family, depending on the situation.

Also, the chances are, unless you grow the stuff yourself, that you're smoking some weed that's either a) laced with coke, to make it more addicting b) been stuffed up some Guatemalan's ass as he walked across the border, or, c) some extremely poor grade shit, stems and seeds and all ground in there so you get less actual content.

Oh. And one more thing. It sucks up all of your money. The real shit doesn't come cheap, you know.

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My signature is slightly better than yours.

[Jess]

I have never been to Singapore. Which is why I asked. Arrested for chewing gum in public? I'm scared to visit there.
(Don't have to worry about the drugs issue)

[Budoka]

Impaler you are WRONG! Hot smoke causing lung cancer - duhh? No.
"hot stinky smoky air that essentially kills all the cells inside your lungs" - scientific description man! nicotine is the thing that makes cigarettes addictive, grass has none. and it's the tar in tobacco which damages your lungs, leads to cancer and stuff - no tar either.
Sorry to hear about your grandfather having cancer - i know how bad it can be for relatives, but that is one case and lung cancer can form from hundreds of different sources. Cancer cells do not pass like a bloody cold either, they are not a virus and form independently in people (they are malformations, unspecific cells that form by numerous means).
Munchies, maybe. But you don't get fat, lazy etc. unless you are prone to those things. Cigarettes are far worse because they cause a different type of fat to form, instead of 'external' belly fat you get internal fat that lines your organs and cannot be burned by exercise.
Slows your reactions?!?! Who can I think of who had amazing reactions? hmmm... Oh, of course, Bruce Lee. Yup, Lee smoked more than the average hippy in his day and his death had nothing to do with it (blood clot due to head injury). I too am a martial artist, and I have noticed nothing but a calm awareness as a result. By the way, its perfectly possible to grow your own so don't give me any of that 'import' crap.
Just don't be so fucking black and white when it comes to natural drugs like grass, you probably take far more harmful things unwittingly. Anyway, the law in the uk should be changed soon so I'm not worried about it.

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It's better to burn out than fade away�

[Impaler]

1) You and Bruce Lee are martial artists. You guys have honed and enhanced reflexes. You train your mind to do that. Ask any doctor and he'll tell you that weed slows the reflexes.

2) Weed numbs the ceratonin (happiness) producers in your brain, letting the drugs take over. The ceratonin eventually replaces less and less, and you smoke more and more to stay happy. Again, ask a doctor.

3) Your body makes a malignant cancer cell about every 1/250th of a second. Usually your white blood cells attack it before it has a chance. But if you routinely subject your lungs to burning particles, then you will routinely burn your lungs. If you burn your lungs, then you kill your cells, including the white ones. Then, as your lungs rebuild, the occasional cancer cell will appear, but the white ones have not. Thenceforth, it spreads, and you died. Not because of the tar. It's because you set your lungs on fire.

4) You don't get fat if you have a high metabolism. But seeing as 60% of the world does not, smoking weed can get you fat. Especially since it shuts down a lot of the important areas in your body (i.e. salivary glands, ceratonin glands, sweat glands). The fat stays there and grows. And if you look at the majority of cigarette smokers, they're all skinny. Tobacco is an appetite suppressant. But we're not debating the differences between cigarettes and marijuana. We're refuting the evils of weed.

5) I never said it was impossible to grow your own. It's silly to vehemently argue things that were never said. But, the truth is, most pot smokers do not grow their own. They buy it from a friend, or from a dealer. That's where my a, b and c come from.

And I'm not being black and white about marijuana. I have grown, sold, and bought it for years. I have read countless books on it. Drugs are bad. You can get a much more natural and powerful high by making a forummer look like a deadhead moron.

And Jess, you are very pretty. And I'm scared to go back to Singapore.

[Budoka]

ALRIGHT! You do know what you are talking about. I don't smoke much anyway and I definitely steer clear of harder stuff AND tobacco. This was just meant to be a light hearted post as I regard dope as a light hearted subject.
'You can get a much more natural and powerful high by making a forummer look like a deadhead moron.'
No offence taken man because I know the reality of my position - lighten up!

----Yeah, Jess is pretty tidy ain't she!----

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It's better to burn out than fade away�

[Impaler]

Heh.

Sorry man. Took it a little too far. I was in debate mode, though. You're not a deadheaded moron in the least. You've posted some mildly amusing things from time to time.

And as a side note, I got really effing high Friday.

And weed is not the most dangerous drug. It's less dangerous than tobacco. Still goddamn dangerous. But not so dangerous that you should be killed or sent to jail for 14 years just for smoking it.

Legalize!



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My signature is slightly better than yours.

[Budoka]

Cheers man.

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It's better to burn out than fade away�

[Brue]

i dont think either of them are a smart idea.
First: smoking cigs causes cancer and makes you stink.
Second: smoking grass makes you high (whats the point in that?), it also makes you stink and it kills your brain cells which dont grow back i might add.
I dont see any posative effects for any of the two. For smoking your pretty much paying to be assasinated. Or you could say you are paying to get your self killed. And, why not get your jollies by doing something productive rather then sittin around smokin whatever and becoming stupider then you already are?
well, thats my opinion.
oh and... smoking is addictive, i dont know about the grass crap though.

[Ragnarok]

joints don't kill your brain.
the chemics added to the normal tobacco cause cancer, not the weed.
the problem is joints aren't done completely with weed, but mixing weed and normal tobacco, so they also can cause cancer.

thanks.

[sh4de]

sorry about this. I have alot to say.

budoka

why smoke grass? isn't grass just the leaf part of the plant. grass is the least effective so you need to smoke shitloads of it to get high.

hash(it has alot of rubber or camel shit mixed in so it's not really good..) or marijuana is the way to go.

and then you said that weed has no tar? hash is made out of tar that you get from the plant right? so there must be some tar in there.

--

ian

they will kill you? damn that's just sick.
do you know how much is 15 oz in grams?

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impaler

how old was your grandfather? mine died to cancer too, but he didn't smoke weed. he smoked cigarettes.

"Ask any doctor and he'll tell you that weed slows the reflexes."

weed doesn't slow down reflexes. you will have problems staying focused, but your reflexes will be _almost_ as good as they normaly are.

"and you smoke more and more to stay happy. Again, ask a doctor. "

THC (the good stuff in weed) will leave your body after two or three months of non smoking. and will leave no damage.

"But if you routinely subject your lungs to burning particles, then you will routinely burn your lungs."

there are bongs and stuff you know. and you dont have to smoke ganja (but then again this is about smoking it right?)
and a normal cannabis smoker doesn't smoke nearly as much as a tobacco smoker does.

"You don't get fat if you have a high metabolism. But seeing as 60% of the world does not, smoking weed can get you fat."

Im underweighted (if that is the word for it) so getting fatter isn't a problem for me.
so weed could be a cure for anorexia?

"They buy it from a friend, or from a dealer. That's where my a, b and c come from."

that is correct and that's why weed should be legal to buy and so on..
(selling should be controlled by the goverment to make sure it's pure weed an all..)

"I have grown, sold, and bought it for years. I have read countless books on it."

well that's really good for you.

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brue

"smoking grass makes you high (whats the point in that?)...I dont see any posative effects for any of the two. "

well, that is the whole point of smoking weed. to get high.
why do you dring alcohol? to get drunk.

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ragnarok

you're right. weed an tobacco are a bad combination and no weed smoker should do that. mixing weed with other natural well burning stuff such as nettle.

wow you got this far? well that's all for now. (me bad in inglish)

[This message has been edited by sh4de (edited March 05, 2001).]

[Ragnarok]

sh4de:
"no weed smoker should do that."

Here comes the economical question. Cigarettes tend to be cheaper.

[Bishop_Six]

Smoking cigs is stupid for obvious reasons(lung cancer, stinkiness, etc). Smoking weed is stupid because it's just the weak man's way to escape reality.

The only drugs that should be illegal are the ones that can cause people to be harmful to others.

Personally, being killed for having weed on you doesn't sound that bad to me. If you don't mind destroying your body, then why should you mind them doing it more efficiently for you?

[Ragnarok]

Isn't art a way of escaping from reality?
Isn't cinema another way?
Novels?
Music?
Computer games?
Any game?

We are constantly escaping from this reality to anothers we create.

What is reality?

[Bishop_Six]

Don't go off on another one of these 'what is reality' things.

That depends on what the definition of 'is' is.

[shahar2k]

just so happens that I am in a psychology class called "altered states of conciousness" talking about things such as the effects of drugs, hypnosis and meditation and so on, on the body.
so here's the deal on what weed actually does to you

the biggest effect is that it lowers your short term memory, this in turn makes it very hard to concentrate (you can keep very few things in your mind) and slows your reactions... because it's harder to process with little ability to keep thoughts "in mind"
so while normally people can remember about 7-9 bits of information in their short term memory, while on marijuana that number goes down.
however it is NOT addictive, except if you are addicted to the feeling (not physically addictive) and the effects are not permanent.

personally, I do not do any drugs, I even havn't even had any alcohol or caffeine in the last 6 months, but between cigarettes and marijuana, I'd pick weed. even between alcohol and weed, I'd pick weed.

another interesting tidbit. from my criminology class, back in the 1900's weed was very popular, however, two industries decided that it was hurting their business too much, and started the campaign against it that made it so unpopular (with the majority) today

those industries were BEER, and COTTON!
cotton, because hemp was a stronger material, lasted longer, and was less harmfull to the soil when grown, and the beer industry because... well people used it more than alcohol

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Maybe I'm paranoid... maybe it's you!

[PandaX52]

I have a family history of alchoholism and drug abuse. I stay away from tobacco, drugs, and alchohol for this reason. It's really a personal decision if you do drugs or not. I don't really care what you do. But if someone hopped up on cocaine runs me over when i'm trying to cross the street, THAT's were i'll draw the line.

I agree with Shahar2k about being addicted to marijuanna mentally and not physically.

You'd be suprised how many things in life are mind over manner.I do realize the irony when I'm preaching about genetics and the power of mental addiction in the same post.....oh well.....

[el tigre]

a cupla years ago I was getting really stressed out at work, drinking lots of coffee, not sleeping well and being sick all the time. This went on for a good six months by which time I was strung out like an alley cat and depressed beyond belief. What helped me get over it??

Weed.

Suddenly I could sleep and eat dead easily, my stomach was no longer in knots. After just a week my life had returned pretty much to normal. I think that the depression was the start of a very bad downward spiral boys and girls. Thats why my personal belief is that weed cannot be as bad as most doctors say.

Anyway, wasn't it banned by doctors paid by that DuPont guy to save his millions.

From a botanical point of view hemp is the most universally fantastic plant ever. It'll grow anywhere (even in the highlands of scotland) it'll give yield within weeks (not months or years) it can be made into paper, fabric, distilled as alcohol or fuel. There isn't a part of it that cannot be used.

So sit back, have a joint, feel good.

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Couldnae hit a coo in the arse wi a banjo if uh wis huddin it by the tail. :�
ICQ#106427315

[Ian]

It's true that Singapore has a lot of stupid laws...but the gum law is kind of a scoff law in that no one cares. It's just illegal to sell gum. I go to the American school and lots of folks have gum...Erm..and Yah they will kill you, HANG YOU if you have 15 oz. of weed (sorry I don't know how that translates into metric)

[sacrelicious]

15 oz. of weed is actually quite a bit. If you made a circle with your thumb and middle finger, you'd have about an eigth of an ounce of weed. So 15 oz. would be a pretty large chunk of weed, larger than a standard brick and almost as big as a regular cinder block. These are rough estimates, but should be about right.

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What is your obsession with my forbidden closet of mystery?

[A.Buttle]

15 oz of weed is about 425 grams. A shitload.

And sh4de, you smoke the flower not the stalk of the leaves. That's why they're called buds.

Budoka, buddy, no tar? What do you think resin is?

Smoking dope is boring anyway. It's all about riding the horse.

I'm kidding.

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I fear the end is near for fish with no hip burrito.
Joe Dillingham
[email protected]

[sh4de]

a.buttle

yes i know, but someone said grass and grass is the leaf part of the plant.
.. or maybe it's weed. damn i can't get these english terms in order. sorry bout that.
leaf part is usually used by mixing it to hash or the flower part if one has just a little amount of kannabis.

flower part, buds..what ever.. can be smoked by itself, but hash needs something to keep it burning (well you CAN smoke pure hash, but it's kinda hard to keep it burning) so usually people use leafs (the not so useful part of the plant), tobacco, neddle or something like that. plahplahplah.

[klaivu]

Okay, this is a looong and boring, off-topic, lecture-type rant :

These days, 3/4 of the deceased have a cancer tumor or tumors. This is *mainly* because people live longer than they used to, but, in the last 50 years we've dumped such a load of chemicals into the nature that it must have affected us somehow. Take DDT, for example: a funny little carsino/mutagen. And these chemicals don't just dissolve, they stay in the nature and circle in the biosphere. And the additives they put in food.. lots of carsinogens out there ...

With cigarettes, the carsinogens are the free radicals in the smoke, plus the tar. The burning particles have no carsinogenic effect. The actual carsinogens affect the cells in many ways ; they can act as near-hormones and trigger " onkogenes " ( cancer causing genes ), such as growth genes and the genes of some hormone receptors, they can wake retroviruses, mutate the chromosomes etc.
Cancer usually takes years to develop.

The only way anyone has ever proven, that tobacco, or its ingredients cause cancer, was by statistics. As far as i know, the tobacco industries still claim that tobacco may not cause cancer, since statistics are never accurate enough. Ever seen the movie insider ? It has been proven, though, that nicotine causes impotence, since it makes the small veins in the swelling tissue of the penis even tighter. Wonder if the cigarette companies could be made to put a big " Warning : May cause impotence " on their cigarette packs .. .

[This message has been edited by klaivu (edited March 07, 2001).]

[Ian]

That's why people eat space cakes.

[Budoka]

sh4de

�why smoke grass? isn't grass just the leaf part of the plant. grass is the least effective so you need to smoke shitloads of it to get high.
hash(it has alot of rubber or camel shit mixed in so it's not really good..) or marijuana is the way to go.�

Grass (weed) is just the leaf part, but it�s not a case of smoking it to get totally plastered, that would be like wanting to get drunk so you reach for the meths.

Hash (dope, whatever) may be mixed with crap with imported stuff (but I doubt it - sounds more like a rumour). Marijuana is the plant, the whole lot.

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A.Buttle

�Budoka, buddy, no tar? What do you think resin is?�

There is no tar. Resin is sap, just like in a tree. it�s the juice of the plant and is usually extracted from living plants, like bleeding a rubber tree. I meant tar, tar - like cigarette tar of which marijuana has none.

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You can smoke weed (grass) on its own but it burns best with something like �bonfire mix�- herbs and stuff. As far as I know, the only parts used widely are the leaves (five �fingers, � serrated edge and light green) which are known as grass, weed - and the sap (dark resin like juice) which is solidified by boiling to remove an amount of the water and can be called resin, dope (as in �dope block�). Also you can use parts of the small flower of the plant and the seeds (usually taken with grass to increase potency). Ways of taking it may include joints (dope or grass in papers [up to 12 and beyond!]) bongs (a pipe, could be a water bong which creates a pool of smoke and bubbles it as you draw), it can be eaten (dope cake [taste like flapjacks!] etc.) and there are probably more but I don�t have personal knowledge of them so nm.

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It's better to burn out than fade away�

[Ragnarok]

It also takes longer to affect you than smoking.