[aquamire]

I wouldnt consider myself an advanced artist, but above all, I think you have to start by drawing from life. I cant explain why or how it happens, but the more you study from life, the more you begin to conceptualize in 3d when it comes to paper. Its something you have to do in order to learn.

A few techiniques:

Stand in a hallway, or at the end of a room. Look to the end of the room, where the corners of the walls meet. Trace the seems of the walls with your fingers. Notice how they move away from you as they come towards you. Thats basic perspective.. you should learn to draw that as well.

Making cross-contour drawings helps as well. Instead of drawing an object by its sillohuete, or where the corner of an object meets the background, draw where you see no contour. Imagine yourself feeling that object, and draw as how you feel.

I dont know much more how I can help you.. perhaps someone else knows better ways to begin thinking in 3d. I'm still learning to, heh.

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-Aquamire
"Quotes are for mislead wussies." - Me.

[This message has been edited by aquamire (edited February 12, 2001).]

[itchi]

i think you are taking the right steps as far as drawing things in cubes to structure things out. as aquamire said, perspective is all important and drawing things out in cubes, spheres, cylinders, etc help to see how forms work in perspective.

i'll just list a couple of things about the head (since you mentioned the 3/4 head) and hopefully won't sound like an idiot.

the head like everthing else has a top, bottom, side, and back. treating it like a cube is important because as the perspective changes. so does eveything else in accordance to it. ie say the head is looking up, the eyes will rise on the cube, and the ears will lower. ear placement is something that confuses some people but if you put a cross on the side of the cube/head, the ear should be right where it intersects. so if you draw the cross on the cube in perspective you should be able to figure it out. eyes are basicallt spheres with circles as the iris floating on top of the sphere. so when you draw the eyes in 3/4, the irises become more eliptical. also think of the body as shapes stuck within shapes. the eyes are spheres stuck within the cube of the head. the eyelids wrap around the spheres according to perspective. in 3/4 the nose might obscre some of the far eye etc...

personally i think the more you can convince the viewer of the perspective that's going on the better the picture. art at it's most basic (as far as structure is concerned) is pretty mathmatical.

breaking things down when you're trying to understand extreme forshortening is supper helpful also.

well, hope that helped more than it confused.

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-sam
http://www.geocities.com/itch_studios/

[Duckman2]

Yeah basiclly you have to figure out where your massess are and shade them in the correct value, value is the key.

[Rag]

Thanks guys,
Well, I understand linear perspective completely. I could draw you cities upon cities. I understand atmospheric perspective very well. But when it comes to the human form, I'm lost as a goose. And the breaking of it down into cubes doesn't really help me, because I make the cubes the wrong size or wrongly placed. I guess, to answer my own question, I need to back off the computer drawing for awhile, break out my sketchbook, and start from the beginning and just draw my butt off everyday until it clicks.
I guess the main thing I'm driving at is this: If you put a model in front of me, I do very well in capturing the form. If I have to create it soley from my brain, forget it. Any other advice? And thanks again for the comments.

[Rag]

I seem to have a hard time seeing in three dimensions. Not in real life of course but translating that into drawings. Such as, alot of my portraits are profiles, but I prefer three quarter view. Anatomy in 3D is also something I have a hard time understanding, even after looking at all the online tuts, drawing cubes for structure, etc. My main problem stems from me working from photos all my life and relying on the nature that photography flattens it all for you. If you see what I mean. How can I improve my seeing these things. I'm at the point of completely giving up on the whole thing and sticking to photos like I've done in the past. Can some of the more advanced artists help a guy out?
I'm intrigued with concept art and I do know some technical drawing such as isometrics and such. But it doesn't seem to help.
Thanks tons

[Pigeon]

Rag,

Here's the thing. Basically you need to break a bad habit, that of relying on photos. And like any other bad habit, it'll be tough to break, and you'll want to go back to it because it's comfortable. But basically you have to kick yourself in the butt, and accept that your work is going to suck for a while.

I went through this a long time ago, when I went from high school to college. I got tired of reproducing the work of photographers (legally or not), so I said I would destroy what I knew so that I could replace it with something better. And what broke me of the habit was gesture drawings. A couple hundred per hour of still-lifes or models. It helps connect what your eye is seeing to what your hand is doing. It's retraining you to see and interpret simultaneously, instead of painstaking copying. The downside is that you end up with hundreds of bad drawings, so use newsprint, or work digitally, but the upside is that you'll be able to draw from life.

Let me know if you're unsure what gesture drawings are.

-Dean

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-Pigeon
http://www.darklight.org/dunakin

[Rag]

Thanks Pigeon,
I'm aware of gesture drawings, I have a degree in Graphic Design, but we didn't go into fine art much. It was a junior college, learn enough to get the copy done and out the door basically. I have taken figure drawing I and II in college, but I guess I didn't learn enough there either. But I'm sure you're right about chunking the photo bit and get off my ass and start drawing. Mostly my whole life in art as been based around portraiture. Heads and shoulders were basically it. I'm going to take everyone's advice and go buy a good large sketch pad and get busy. It just worries me that I'm 36yo and just now getting the hang of what I thought I always knew. I guess you never stop learning.
Appreciate your help alot. Take care.